This is just what I would want to say about the issue. What really came through was his love for Christ, and, thereby, the weak, the powerless, the unborn-- a servant of God and people. He didn't care about being "right." I'm going to copy and paste this so I can refer to it later.
Cool. You have your own blog. How do you get one of those? As always, you make compelling points on this issue. Jesus is grieved by condemnation (judgment) and abortion-- how can we address either issue without sacrificing one to the other? I am judgmental when I say abortion is murder, yet, if that is what I believe, how can I in good conscience sit on my hands and let it continue? To me that is like saying that because a person doesn't think murder is murder, then her or she should be allowed to do it. I think on some level you don't quite believe that the babies (embryos, etc.) have the same value as people (the ones you can see). Both have equal value to me, the mothers who feel they have no options, and the babies who definitely don't. We've gone around the carousel on this issue before, so thanks for listening to me again. In my defense, you brought it up! :) I just couldn't help myself.
Go to http://blogspot.com and sign up. It's great! Yep we've gone around. I don't look at Daniel, Kyla, Chloe the same way as I look at the frozen fertilized embryos that didn't make it. You don't really, either. It was sad, but there was no eulogy.
At what point would there be a eulogy? If they died five minutes before birth or five minutes after it? My friend lost Hayley at five months gestation-- my friend's grief was as deep and as real as it would have been if Hayley had died four or five months later (after birth). Just because we don't know who they are yet, doesn't mean that they aren't real people.
We lost one at about that stage before Seth came along. It was very difficult. Would it compare to losing Seth? No. Seth has a history as well as potential. His eulogy would be long and rich. Many parents grieve because they feel cheated out of something they thought they were entitled to. Perhaps a greater grief would come if they cheated God out of a life that He intended. I don't pretend to know how He feels about it. I'm not convinced that how we feel about it is even relevant. Neither you nor I really know how God feels, although our guesses seem to disagree somewhat. Again, if we continue the discussion, we presume to speak for God. That's where I disagree with many conservatives. I don't feel that it is our business, either individually or collectively (via the government) to coerce others to follow God's laws.
That's the point I agree with, except that I feel human life is the single issue that is worth regulating. On any other issue, I understand that morality can't be legislated. A clear separation of church and state is the only answer, to protect the rights of Christians and non-Christians alike. The abortion issue is to me is unlike other social issues because human life is at stake-- babies should not be killed.
I too agree that babies should not be killed. How many people do you honestly believe would say, "Oh yeah let's kill babies"? I am in line with Dr. Howell, who are we to coerce others to follow God's law. What one chooses to do in their life is between them and the Father. I personally would try to prevent anyone from not having an abortion but in the end who am I to judge. That is one thing Jesus tells us not to do. It is not our job to judge others but rather the Fathers job.
"Our Lord never insists upon obedience; He tells us very emphatically what we ought to do, but He never takes means to make us do it. We have to obey Him out of a oneness of spirit. That is why whenever Our Lord talked about discipleship, He prefaced it with an IF - you do not need to unless you like. "If any man will be My disciple, let him deny himself," let him give up his right to himself to Me."
Oswald Chambers: http://www.myutmost.org/11/1102.html
Oswald Chambers: http://www.myutmost.org/11
I will do everything possible to keep people from killing my family members. I'm just not sure what our responsibilities are, collectively. For example, I'm not convinced that our police system is quite what God intended. When it comes to the point that video surveillance is everywhere making sure we keep in line, I feel that we've overstepped. Even in Old Testament times there was provision (special cities were set aside) for those who had inadvertently killed another. Retribution also was possible (except in those cities). That's why I believe in the right to bear arms. In bible times, parents were completely responsible for their own children, even to the point of having them stoned for disobedience.
I do agree with protecting the weak. I do not condone abortion in any way (except in extreme circumstances). I wouldn't go as far as Obama does on this issue. My point is that, even possibly with murder, God does not coerce us. We choose our actions, he carries out His judgments.
Do Christians really trust that God will take care of them even without an intrusive police force? Do they really trust Him with their children? Do they trust that He knows what is best, even when a loved one dies?
"The first thing God does with us is to get us based on rugged Reality until we do not care what becomes of us individually as long as He gets His way for the purpose of His Redemption. Why shouldn't we go through heartbreaks? Through those doorways God is opening up ways of fellowship with His Son. Most of us fall and collapse at the first grip of pain; we sit down on the threshold of God's purpose and die away of self-pity, and all so called Christian sympathy will aid us to our death bed. But God will not. He comes with the grip of the pierced hand of His Son, and says - 'Enter into fellowship with Me; arise and shine.' If through a broken heart God can bring His purposes to pass in the world, then thank Him for breaking your heart."
Chambers: http://www.myutmost.org/11/1101.html
Chambers: http://www.myutmost.org/11
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